Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Dec 23, 2009 9:15:27 GMT -6
Something that ChristianJames said got me thinking. Here it is the 24th century, but what kind of technology do you imagine the Federation will have inthe next century? It could be an extension of current technology, something we've seen other advanced races use, or something completely new.
For example, I wonder if we'll ever solve the positronic brain problem. On the one hand, though, there doesn't seem to be any reason to. Data was interested in this because he wanted a child. But why spend a lot of effort creating a sentient android if he or she is going to be recognized as a Free individual and no longer under your control?
On the other hand, how about Intelligent starship computers (like in the series "Andromeda")?
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Post by andrewlee on Dec 23, 2009 9:45:34 GMT -6
In the later 24th, 25 centuries and beyond, there is no doubt technology will advance in the areas of positronic brains. there may be more advanced Soong type androids that are sentient. Technology could advance enough for a ship's computer to become sentient. This could be a problem if the sentient ship refuses to obey orders!! Ships will get faster, but by how much, it's hard to say! I think they will have both advancements of existing technologies and new technologies!!
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Arkroyal
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Post by Arkroyal on Dec 23, 2009 17:09:28 GMT -6
Actually some people would probably want to create sentient androids such as Data for much the same reason Soong did - create life, I can see it being so difficult only a select few of those few who attempt would be able to actually manage it. Sentient androids could also be useful to provide a bridge across generations - after all they can have a "life-span" exceeding that of humans because bar unfortunate malfunctions the technology is clearly durable enough to last two or maybe three human lifetimes.
On the ship's becoming faster it could be they find a way of breaking the warp 10 barrier without their molecular structure becoming excessively scrambled.
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Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Dec 28, 2009 8:53:41 GMT -6
Technology could advance enough for a ship's computer to become sentient. This could be a problem if the sentient ship refuses to obey orders! For that very reason, I think it would be a mistake to make them sentient. But an Artificial Intelligent computer, even if not completely sentient, would be a pretty good idea. I'm pretty sure there is an absolute limit to how fast material objects can go, even warping space. It's just not clear what this limit is. The Kelvans, for example, could travel from the Andromeda galaxy to ours in only 400 years.
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Post by andrewlee on Dec 28, 2009 10:29:20 GMT -6
With going faster like at warp 9.9999 would take more energy and better systems to utilize that energy. Replicators making more complex things/molecules would be interesting!
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Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Dec 30, 2009 10:04:17 GMT -6
Remember in the TNG episode "Ethics", that doctor used a genitronic replicator to create a new spine for Worf after he was paralyzed. It didn't work then, but I'm sure the bugs will be worked out soon. And how about synthetic blood?
That, along with nanite technology, would make it possible to either repair or replace any organ in the body, even the nervous system. Or even correct errors in DNA which cause birth defects. No more blind children lilke Laforge, having to live with prosthetics!
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edify
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Post by edify on Jan 2, 2010 21:49:45 GMT -6
Well, Atoz, the whole part about correcting errors in DNA that cause birth defects leads to quite a huge ethical dilemma. In fact, one aspect of that ethical dilemma was explored in Voyager's last season. A couple things I'd like to know about is first, remember in the Voyager episode "Threshold," Tom Paris broke the warp 10 threshold, albeit with some bizarre side effects. Since Voyager has made it home, surely their information on breaking the barrier and the side-effects has been turned over to the Federation so their scientists and doctors can begin working on preventing the side effects. I'd be curious if achieving warp 10 safely would be a possibility in the 25th century. Also, the end of Star Trek: Nemesis hinted that maybe the Romulans and Federation would become allies in the future. If that happens, I'd be interested to know if the Treaty of Algeron would have been amended to allow the Federation unlimited development of cloaking devices. Now, granted the Defiant was fitted with one, and in the alternate future in "All Good Things..." the Enterprise-D of the future had one, but the Enterprise-D was destroyed before that future could come about and the Defiant was a special case. I'd be interested if an alliance with the Romulans would allow the Federation to outfit their own ships with a cloaking device.
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Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Jan 4, 2010 8:50:00 GMT -6
Since as far as I know, this so-called "Warp 10 barrier" was only mentioned in that one VOY episode, I don't know what you people are talking about. I don't know of any difficulty in that regard.
We've had some interesting conversations in the past about cloaking devices and the treaty of Algeron. The Federation uses cloaking techology in "duck blinds", and in the Defiant as you mentioned. I once speculated that the treaty prohibits the Federation from employing it on warships, and then only if the Romulans agree not to employ plasma torpedoes. I also speculated that the isolitic weapons used by the Sona were of Romulan origin, thus putting the treaty in abeyance. What do you think?
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edify
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Post by edify on Jan 4, 2010 13:09:29 GMT -6
Well, it's been awhile since I've seen the episode but crossing the warp 10 threshold results in whomever crossed it to be mutated into a completely different species. That's why the Voyager deemed it too dangerous to simply achieve warp 10 to get back to Federation space.
As for the Romulan/Son'a connection, I'll have to re-watch the movie to see what you mean. But it's a possibility. I'd just like to see whatever became of events after Star Trek: Nemesis. If the Romulans really became allies or just "friendlier" with the Federation.
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Post by andrewlee on Jan 4, 2010 14:56:25 GMT -6
Since as far as I know, this so-called "Warp 10 barrier" was only mentioned in that one VOY episode, I don't know what you people are talking about. I don't know of any difficulty in that regard. We've had some interesting conversations in the past about cloaking devices and the treaty of Algeron. The Federation uses cloaking technology in "duck blinds", and in the Defiant as you mentioned. I once speculated that the treaty prohibits the Federation from employing it on warships, and then only if the Romulans agree not to employ plasma torpedoes. I also speculated that the isolitic weapons used by the Sona were of Romulan origin, thus putting the treaty in abeyance. What do you think? Interesting points! I have wondered about the cloaking devices in "Insurrection" on the holo-ship and duck blinds. I have understood the treaty of Algeron to state that the Federation can't develop cloaking technology, but what about cloaking technology they already had or that may have been given to the by the Klingons??
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Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Jan 6, 2010 9:04:38 GMT -6
Well, it's been awhile since I've seen the episode but crossing the warp 10 threshold results in whomever crossed it to be mutated into a completely different species. That's why the Voyager deemed it too dangerous to simply achieve warp 10 to get back to Federation space. I'm not too familiar with VOY. All I can say is I've seen many examples of the Enterprise temporarily moving faster than warp ten (for example, when the Kelvans took over the ship and tried to take it to the Andromeda galaxy), and I don't remember them ever having that kind of problem.
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Post by andrewlee on Jan 6, 2010 11:36:42 GMT -6
There are 2 warp scales which are different. The TOS warp scale and the next generation warp scale. The old warp scale warp 10 is 1000C aka 1000 times the speed of light which would be around warp 7.9 on the new warp scale. Warp 10 on the new scale is infinite speed. The old warp scale is calculated on multiplying a number by itself 3 times like warp 3 is 27C 3X3X3=27C. New scale warp 3 is 39C aka 39 times the speed of light and is calculated by a complicated mathematical formula. Check with Memory Alpha on warp scales old and new and you will see for yourself.
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edify
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Post by edify on Jan 7, 2010 2:09:02 GMT -6
Ah, yes. Andrewlee hit the nail on the head. I misunderstood what you were saying, Atoz.
Indeed, as Andrew said, the warp scales are different in The Original Series and the rest of the shows. The Original Series Enterprise may have gone faster than warp ten, but by the 24th century (for The Next Generation), the warp scale had been changed. Warp ten was always considered impossible to attain. In fact, I believe the Enterprise-D's top speed was warp 9.975.
In the Voyager episode, "Threshold," Tom Paris (in a shuttlecraft aptly named Cochrane), he achieved warp ten. Achieving warp ten basically placed Tom Paris at all points of the universe simultaneously. He could drop out of warp anywhere from Federation space to uncharted regions of the universe. It was only when he realized the Voyager was looking for him that he dropped out of warp where he had originally left from. Achieving warp 10 also caused bizarre side effects -- Tom Paris mutated into a creature. So warp 10 was deemed unsafe which is why Voyager never attempted to go to warp 10 to try and return home.
It should also be noted, however, that in "All Good Things...", in the alternate future shown to us by Q, the warp scale had again been altered because in order to leave the Romulan Neutral Zone, Admiral Riker ordered the Enterprise-D (fitted with a third warp nacelle) to proceed at warp thirteen. So the scale had again been changed in that alternate future. Whether it really will or not remains to be seen, as it was 25 years in the future and we know that other events depicted will not happen the way they did in that episode.
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Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Jan 7, 2010 9:55:08 GMT -6
This is the first I've heard about any of this. I should also point out that there are good reasons for thinking that some of the events in "All Good Things..." were fantasies created by Q. For instance, we know now that the Enterprise D was destroyed just a few years later.
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Atoz 77
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Post by Atoz 77 on Jan 11, 2010 9:54:17 GMT -6
I've been to Memory Alpha. The formula Andrew is talking about may look complicated, but it really isn't. All it means is that to find the velocity of a ship (in multiples of the speed of light), in the "old" system you raised the Warp factor to the third power. So Warp 7 would be 7 to the third power or 343 times the speed of light. In the "new" system, instead of the third power you raise it to the power of 10/3, in other words 3.3333. So Warp 7 would be 656 times the speed of light. The only thing I don't understand is why they arbitrarily set warp 10 equal to infinity. That doesn't make sense. [The only reason I can think of is to be consistent with the VOY episode "Threshold", which according to Memory Alpha is one of the worst in Star Trek history. Even the writer admits that it was an ill-conceived idea. He may have been thinking of the Adams Infinite Improbability Drive at the time. ]
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